Update on the Update

Plugin for the HAI family of security panels
ricks
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Postby ricks » Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:05 pm

So it sounds like the current effort has been scrubbed and nothing more will happen until the new firmware is released and a new MLHAI plugin built?

HAI has told us we are on their short list to provide the SDK of their new firmware when it is available. That was a few weeks ago.


Is that what you're saying?

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DavidL
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Postby DavidL » Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:35 pm

No, that is not what I am saying. I said that we are on the short list to get the SDK when it is available.

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cborod
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Postby cborod » Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:57 pm

hey Smooth~ That's great news that you're getting the new SDK. I'm sure it will answer a lot of questions.....

Dave~you mean you found the old temp change method lacking :shock: ?
ChrisB


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ricks
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Postby ricks » Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:14 pm

Sorry. Emails and PM's have gone unanswered. No one from Cinemar updates the forum with a status. Tough to tell what you folks are thinking. Wouldn't mind much if it were in beta but beta ended last spring. I bought in May and it had so many problems its been unusable.

Its one thing to buy a broken plugin. Its another thing to wait 10 months with absolutely no fixes. But the worst thing is to never, ever, get an answer, update or target date.

Please, just say when it will be fixed.

Rick

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DaveB
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Postby DaveB » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:46 am

That is good news as that will also include the updates for the new thermostat, which is very nice.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

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Postby DaveB » Sat Mar 01, 2008 8:35 pm

David; is there any update on the progress? Sorry, but the same old story is getting rather old.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

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Postby DaveB » Thu Mar 06, 2008 12:40 am

SMooth;
I have been thinking about this whole HAI thing, and I get more upset as time moves on, and the more I think about the driver.

I am not intending to rail you yet once more about this, but need to say this;

Many other drivers around here have been updated or created since the HAI driver has even been touched. It seems to me that automation panel drivers would be one of your core focus items, but for some reason, HAI is not. Maybe it is lack of users, but only you can tell us that.

ALl of us that use HAI and Cinemar have invested probably more in HAI than Cinemar. I can tell you that CInemar would go out of my door propr to my HAI system.

The date obviously continues to slip, and I seriously doubt that you will produce any HAI updates prior to summer, but that is just my oppinion.

The existing driver is not all that bad if you would just fix a few core items. Yea, we all want the world, but a few items would buy you several months and prevent you from receiving more of these posts.

Others may differ, but give me IP accesss, the ability to arm/disarm with user codes, and a few more lighting commands, and I am good to go for a bit. Forget the new code version and all the issues that will surround it for now. Just give us some basic advances, then drop back and develop that cool new driver that I know you can.

By doing this, you will satisfy the masses, and in the end, still wind up in the same place as you will with the current approach.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

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Postby cborod » Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:26 pm

DaveB ~ not quite sure I agree with you there.....maybe 6 months ago, but today as it stands, there is too much work do be done to get this current plugin up to usability and the time spent on the old driver would take away from the new driver.

Along with your requests...how about basic stability, a cure for the 1111 login issues, proper handling of thermostats, Buttons...not even operable yet, and the list goes on and on. Lots of work, and all a distraction from the real prize which is a full-featured, reliable HAI integration via MLServer.

IMHO we're better off right now with HomeSeer as the plug-in to HAI and talking to it with MLHS until a proper ML plugin arrives.
ChrisB





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Postby DavidL » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:05 pm

The good odds, is that MLHAI will be written to the old firmware and the HAI sdk. The new sdk isn't due out for a while. There is a lot of communication changes with the new firmware so we will have to wait to get the new sdk to support the new firmware.

When the new sdk is available, then the plugin will be modified to handle both old and new.

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Postby DaveB » Fri Mar 07, 2008 9:47 pm

Smooth; I think that the two step approach is the best. Get the basics out now and get the driver "family" complient, then write to the new SDK that will be available late in the summer.

CBOrod; Two things, first - I moved away from HS years ago and will not go back. I control everything directly with as few layers as I can tolerate. I still do have all of my HS licensing, but the package is sitting on one of my servers doing nothing.
Second; I find the existing HAI driver to be stable in my environment, just not feature rich. Dave P got to a point in the driver development path, then moved onto other more pressing items. The problem is that he never came back to finish the original design.
OK Three points - you must also remember that the HAI protocol is far from any standard and that they also have many issues related to temperature control, lighting level control and the whole mess of which "code" controls the panel. Only now are they fixing some of that. Many of the issues with the Cinemar driver are due to the HAI issues. It is a hard driver to develope.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

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Postby cborod » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:47 pm

daveB /I certainly see your point...I wanted the thinner system layer too.....still do, guess we're just at similar but different positions regarding MLHAI.

I believe our mutual agreement point is we want to use ML as the front end AND back end of an elegant HA system....we're so close....very close...and maybe that's the thing that gets me the most.....because it's also so elusive....

I also appreciate and empathize with the HAI complexity issue. No doubt it's a bear.

The bottom line is I paid for helping to develop a working plug in. Note, I did not expect "working" out of the box. My investment up front was clearly such, an investment that Cinemar would develop a functional HAI mechanism for ML.

A year later I'm hoping they'll revive that effort with as much passion as they have attached to MLGD, MLDVD 375, and other models of excellence.

When their passion comes though, the product shines! ~ truly shines, and that's what I hope will happen with HAI.
ChrisB





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DaveB
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Postby DaveB » Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:49 am

I actually got away from HS when I started deploying Cinemar to my customers. There was simply no way for me to manage all of the updates needed to keep everything working. It is hard enough just keeping both my live and test servers in my own home updated.

In a customer environment, you want everything as simple as you can get it. That is why in all of my installations, HAI controls everything that it can, and Cinemar is simply the graphic view of that control. Also, I never got to the point of being comfortable with the elimination of HAI keypads when I also installed Cinemar. That is due to the whole user ID issue and lack of real security.

There are a few other front end graphic control systems out there that I did deploy with HAI and did eliminate the HAI keypads (or just simply installed the HAI pad in a nearby closit for backup).

I will know when this driver comes of age when I feel comfortable enough to eliminate my own HAI keypads in my home and control and monitor everything through my touchscreens. Until then, the driver needs work.

My frustration with Cinemar is the lack of attention that this driver has received and the length of time between updates. There is no compellng reason why this driver should not have been updated months ago.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

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Postby DavidL » Sat Mar 08, 2008 9:13 am

The compelling reason is that there are many other users that want Cinemar to concentrate on very different tasks.

We know how many MLHAI users are out there...we have surveyed them so we know how they feel about the plugin. We also see a few of them posting here that are having difficulty with the current release.

Not that you didn't already know that.

BTW, in rereading my recent MLHAI post, it might not be clear...we will be continuing the MLHAI development with the OLD firmware, and release that update. Later, when the new firmware is available, the plugin will be extended to also support that version. If this becomes a second plugin, that will be determined when we get working examples going to see how they can coexist.

A big log jamb of development is about to uncork. MLHAI will get it's due.

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Postby DaveB » Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:17 am

Thanks David and I appreciate your response and efforts.

I look forward to assisting with the testing when you get to that point.
Thanks!

Dave Bruner
:shock:

ricks
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Postby ricks » Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:43 pm

OK, so I'll be the one to "pick the scab" as they say...

With DVDLobby having been released, is there any movement on the MLHAI re-write?

Rick


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